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After our previous interview with Doctor of Philosophy, public figure and volunteer Sviatoslav Litynskyi, who helped to provide 250 cars to the military, he became a witness in one of the criminal cases for two weeks. The police conducted a search of his home in Lviv when Sviatoslav was abroad. But the peak of this story was the Facebook post by the President of Ukraine, stating that thieves and fraudsters have no place among volunteers. This was perceived by many as a statement directed at Litynskyi, Dzyndra, Muzychuk, and others...
What is the current state of the case, in which you were a witness? Have you been summoned for testimony or explanations?
I haven’t got back the 15,000 hryvnias taken from me. No, there was no second summons yet. How are things developing in the state in general? The Verkhovna Rada created a temporary investigative commission, which should deal only with humanitarian aid matters [on September 20, the Ukrainian Parliament (Verkhovna Rada) established the Temporary Investigative Commission (TIC) to investigate possible violations of Ukrainian legislation in the field of receiving, distributing, transporting, storing, and using of humanitarian and other aid for the intended purpose, as well as ineffective use of state property]. Being physically present at one meeting and virtually at the second one, I saw that TIC understands the priorities. It can clearly distinguish, for example, the Lviv Regional Military Administration, which received 431,000 tons of humanitarian aid for free and, according to this Commission, did not provide any reporting on where it was transferred. And they clearly demarcate the cases where a volunteer was provoked or incited to transfer the car to a different military unit than it was agreed upon and paid, as was the case in Lviv with Dzyndra or Muzychuk.
It was a very interesting conversation. The temporary investigative commission came to the Lviv Regional Military Administration, announcing the facts about the millions of kilograms of aid transferred. Representatives of the Security Service of Ukraine (SBU), the police, the State Bureau of Investigation (DBR) were sitting, and a member of the TIC said: «Look, so much humanitarian aid was transferred without accounting. You, the police, maybe have some questions, maybe you’re investigating something here?» And the police responded: «No, everything is fine.» «Or maybe there is a question in the SBU or DBR?» – he asks. «No, we don’t have any questions,» – the representatives answered.
That is, it turns out that if the state body improperly disposes of humanitarian aid – no issues arise. But if the volunteers bought something with their money, handed it over and received some kind of compensation – then questions arised immediately. Anyway, it is great that the Verkhovna Rada understands this. It also created a working group to change the law, now they are working on the possibility of changing the Criminal Code so that there are no such pretexts. Hence the police, following the letter of the law, would not bring to justice those people who really help the army, really invest their time and money for actually helping the state.
Is there already some text with these changes?
No, there is no text yet, but a working group actually exists and deals with it [on October 25, an information notice appeared on the website of the Verkhovna Rada that the Committee on Social Policy and Protection of Veterans’ Rights has begun working on a new version of the Law of Ukraine «On Humanitarian Aid».] As far as I know, Natalia Pipa, MP from Lviv, turned to scientists regarding the possible correction of those shortcomings in the wording of Article 201-2 of the Criminal Code of Ukraine, so there will already be some scientific conclusion. It is possible that other deputies have also appealed about this. I really hope that the text of the article will be corrected.
Read also: «State would have to support the volunteers.» Public activist Sviatoslav Litynskyi on criminal cases
Another positive moment: people’s deputy Roman Hryshchuk created an initiative group, the meetings of which were held under the leadership of the chairman of the Verkhovna Rada. They discussed problems with volunteering. A number of issues were raised, in particular, regarding the incorrect wording of Article 201-2 of the Criminal Code of Ukraine and Resolution of the Cabinet of Ministers No. 174 «Some issues of the passage of humanitarian aid through the customs border of Ukraine under martial law», that goods purchased with the money of specific individuals are declaratively recognized as humanitarian aid provided free of charge by foreign countries. I think a decision should come in a month or two.
You have not stopped searching for cars abroad, importing them to Ukraine and handing them over to military units, or even to the police. Are there any difficulties with this?
There weren’t any until recently. Of course, they were with the search [of cars], because finding a car, buying it, and collecting money is always difficult. But now, a new complication has arisen: last week, when handing over a car, we were told: «Oh, it’s from Litynskyi, but the SBU will come to us to check it! You know, it’s better not to pass it on, look for someone else». That is, the military unit has a real need to get a car, but the police has created such an «aura» that there would be problems with documents, so [the military] finds it better to avoid getting it. Sadly...
But as I understand, you managed to transfer it elsewhere?
We’ll still pass it on as intended, but we’ll use another, a bit more complex scheme.
I know that all this time, you had to solve problems with filling out declarations.
Yes, the following problem arises with customs declarations when crossing the border: the driver declares that he won’t pay taxes for the car, as it is to be donated to a certain military unit. The state came up with the idea that this declaration would be called a «declaration on the recognition of a product», in particular, a car as humanitarian aid. It indicates the person who provides this humanitarian aid, and this person should correctly indicate the owner of the car. That is, if I went abroad and bought a car, I became its owner and provider. So it’s obvious that I need to be listed since I have a sales contract drawn up for me.
However, at the border, customs officials do things differently. They always ask, demand, and force to indicate some mythical persons – volunteers from Poland, Great Britain, Germany – depending on where the car is imported from. In fact, they say: «No, write it like this. You cannot be a provider of aid, because you are a citizen of Ukraine.» What do they mean that I can’t? I bought it, I hand it over and declare that it’s a humanitarian aid. Some drivers spend up to three hours at the border only to be told: «No. Then, write a written refusal that you will not recognize this car as humanitarian aid.»
Customs officials can also rewrite the declarations themselves. We recently bought a car, paid money abroad, and a Frenchman volunteered to be the driver. I gave him a printed declaration, because he, obviously, didn’t know Ukrainian and would not have declared this car himself. At the border, when he came with this declaration, the customs officer simply rewrote it and put a stamp on the new one. But that man did not understand the Ukrainian language! They gave the document with a seal back to him – well, he drove on, thank God. But when I had to hand over the car, I noticed that it was handed over by... France. Which France?! I turned to the Lviv customs office. I really want to praise them, because based on my post on Facebook, they contacted and invited me. It is very correct and positive that the state body is acting so proactively. On October 27, I was assured that they had a working meeting, where all department heads were told to indicate the person who is the recipient of this humanitarian aid according to the sales contract, not some mythical person. Without any quarrels at the border and persuasions like «no, let’s write the previous owner», so that everything corresponds to reality.
Do I understand correctly that due to this clarification, no more trouble should happen after October 27-28?
As I understand, this was verbalized at the workshop and recorded in the transcript. But such a document was not sent. Still, I hope this problem will be solved after October 28.
Has it all affected the volunteer movement?
Certainly. Now, people are trying to be much more careful. Horizontal trust is lost. Because of such provocations, incitement to commit a pseudo-crime, which is still formally a crime, you stop trusting people with whom you have worked for a long time. You begin to think that you did not make the right agreement, and the law does not provide for this. So yes, it had a negative effect.
But we see that the authorities are trying to fix it. In particular, you received an award from the Ministry of Defense.
Yes, the Ministry awarded me a medal for helping the Armed Forces, and this is positive. But, you see, it is like two hands: one does not know what the other one is doing. The Ministry of Defense seems to be interested in increasing the defense capability of the army, it fulfils the assigned duties. But the police... I don’t know if they consider it their task to incite to commit a crime.
In addition to spending money, you also collect it. Recently, it was shown how payment was received from the National Council of Ukraine on Television and Radio Broadcasting for the court case it lost. What exactly was the matter?
Regarding the National Council, I had several lawsuits. If I’m not mistaken, there were three of them. In fact, it should regulate the television and radio space in such a way that the state would have some positives from it – integrational or motivational, so that people understand that we need to fight for our state. The National Council, in my opinion, actually betrays these interests. The law clearly states that TV channels must broadcast series in Ukrainian. But last summer, I noticed something and turned to the National Council: «Look, the TV series are broadcast in a foreign, Russian language. You should fine for this, deprive TV channels of their licenses in extreme cases.» The National Council confirmed: «Yes, indeed, there are violations, but we will not do anything, let someone else do it.» I challenged it in court, and as a result, they lost. Then the active phase of the war began, and there was a lull in that matter. And now, in compliance with the court’s decision, the Council reimbursed the money for the lawyer’s work and for the lawsuit. Before that, there was a similar case before the National Council, which must require TV channels to air at least 50% of programs produced in Ukraine. Then I monitored the broadcasts for several days and said: «Look, TV channel «Ukraine» and, it seems, «Inter» give less than 50% of the national product. This is your responsibility. You have to hold them accountable for this.» And the National Council replied to the court that it had reviewed the other days and that there were no such violations, so everything is fine. The court said that the only body that has the right to monitor TV space is the National Council. So, my monitorings are unofficial and should not be taken into account. And although they submitted data for other days, everything is fine, there are no problems. This time, I lost the case.
We will remind you that earlier, Sviatoslav Litynskyi told about the ways Ukrainian volunteers purchase cars abroad for the Ukrainian military, despite differences in national legislations of different countries and contradictions with the Ukrainian police. Read the material here.
Sergiy Smirnov spoke
Text: Marichka Ilyina, Translated by Vitalii Holich
Photo from Svyatoslav Litynskyi’s Facebook page
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